debate-pointsBill Maher presented the following argument:
The irony of religion is that because of its power to divert man to destructive courses, the world could actually come to an end. The plain fact is, religion must die for mankind to live. The hour is getting very late to be able to indulge in having in key decisions made by religious people. By irrationalists, by those who would steer the ship of state not by a compass, but by the equivalent of reading the entrails of a chicken. George Bush prayed a lot about Iraq, but he didn’t learn a lot about it. Faith means making a virtue out of not thinking. It’s nothing to brag about. And those who preach faith, and enable and elevate it are intellectual slaveholders, keeping mankind in a bondage to fantasy and nonsense that has spawned and justified so much lunacy and destruction. Religion is dangerous because it allows human beings who don’t have all the answers to think that they do. Most people would think it’s wonderful when someone says, “I’m willing, Lord! I’ll do whatever you want me to do!” Except that since there are no gods actually talking to us, that void is filled in by people with their own corruptions and limitations and agendas. And anyone who tells you they know, they just know what happens when you die, I promise you, you don’t. How can I be so sure? Because I don’t know, and you do not possess mental powers that I do not. The only appropriate attitude for man to have about the big questions is not the arrogant certitude that is the hallmark of religion, but doubt. Doubt is humble, and that’s what man needs to be, considering that human history is just a litany of getting shit dead wrong. This is why rational people, anti-religionists, must end their timidity and come out of the closet and assert themselves. And those who consider themselves only moderately religious really need to look in the mirror and realize that the solace and comfort that religion brings you actually comes at a terrible price. If you belonged to a political party or a social club that was tied to as much bigotry, misogyny, homophobia, violence, and sheer ignorance as religion is, you’d resign in protest. To do otherwise is to be an enabler, a mafia wife, for the true devils of extremism that draw their legitimacy from the billions of their fellow travelers. If the world does come to an end here, or wherever, or if it limps into the future, decimated by the effects of religion-inspired nuclear terrorism, let’s remember what the real problem was that we learned how to precipitate mass death before we got past the neurological disorder of wishing for it. That’s it. Grow up or die.
This fiery criticism details what he perceives to be much of what compels much contemporary irrational and obstinate behavior. Assuming the premise that he presents, that religion is dangerous, how specifically is it dangerous?
Religion is dangerous. However, a concerted effort to eliminate religion would probably be worse. Think of religion as roughly akin to alcohol, and a serious effort to remove it roughly akin to prohibition: People still use/want religion regardless of whether or not it is ‘permitted’, and when faced with serious opposition to their faith, they become much more dangerous.
Yes, of course, we need to do everything we can to keep serious fanatics out of high office, because no one wants someone consulting jesus with their finger on the button. But the same goes for drug use- you don’t want a drunk general. At the same time, we don’t mind if our leaders have the occasional glass of wine- it’s their right, it probably improves their quality of life, making them more stable and better leaders in the long run. The same thing with mild religion- it’s soothing, an indulgence that makes people happier and thus more stable.
So yes, please go ahead and ridicule all religious ideas, but proclamations that religion has to end just give the Theocrats ammunition- the only societies that have made a go of eliminating religion were themselves in the grip of non-religious but equally toxic irrational ideologies.
Bill Maher is not someone we should be holding up as an example, because while he is an atheist, he subscribes to some ideas that are just as wacky as any religion (anti-vax). That’s the problem- most people who truly, vehemently oppose the worst ideologies are themselves a proponent of some other equally toxic nonsense.
It was very dangerous for the 14 year old girl who was whipped recently to death for the crime of being raped.
Yes it can.
Any organised system of belief can and will be exploited by the unscrupulous.
One of the biggest dangers of religion stems from the fact that we are all innately curious about, well, everything. Religion claims to have the answers to some of the things we’re curious about and effectively quashes further inquiry. At best, it removes individuality from the person and at worst, it seeks to actively stifle actual technological advancement and the betterment of people’s lives.
Religion MAY be dangerous.
destructive doctrines can lead to mass suicides in a cult, or exhortation to Jihad can lead to terrorism.
clashing ideas; people kill each other because they think they are “right” and the others are “wrong.”
Religion MAY be beneficial.
The vast majority of the 6 billion people on earth are religions. Relatively few of them are terrorists, Jihadists, or suicidal. In fact religious people (who meet regularly) have been shown to earn up to 10% more than those who are unreligious. Many cultures are based around relgions. Without the religions the cultures would cease to exist in their present form.
Conclusion: religion is inherently dangerous, but so is life.
For those who point to the Old Testament as proof that Christianity is dangerous, read Acts 15, which explains how only certain portions of the OT law still apply to Christians (preferably read more than just ch15).
For those who say Islam is a religion of peace - check out how the more violent passages of the Koran are toward the end, and how what was written later has more weight.
I think, that Religion can be dangerous as any other groupmovement. There is a need to seperate state and church i think. Because of groupidentity and improvement of ideas in a changing society.
No. Men are dangerous. A saying in the U.S. “Guns don’t kill people, people do.”
Of the millions of people who bow their heads to Mecca each day, we can find a select few who would go out and blow up a shopping mall. Take away their religion and we still have the psychopaths- they’d just find another reason to validate their behavior.
We nearly blew ourselves up in the 60’s because of political ideas. Men use their ideas to justify immoral courses of action. And while some religions may preach these courses- not all do. Pinning religion as dangerous is denying that some men are inherently evil, rather it is the ideas that turn them so.
People have a choice as to whether they peacefully observe their beliefs or they take them out into the world and use them to beget repression and violence. But we can do that with any belief, not just religious ones. The fault lies with individuals and their choices, not a broad umbrella under which they hide.
In response to Mr. Maher- any man who falls back to a single idea when making complex decisions that affect many people is unfit for office. But such men come in many flavors, not just religious ones. The world will destroy itself because of baser human emotions we have not yet tamed- not because of higher cognitive thinking that theorizes about the nature of reality.
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