deconversionIn cases where someone, whom you otherwise respect, has successfully used religion to turn their life around (e.g. break a habit of substance abuse); how can you politely reason with them when they confidently start telling you about their unthinking and naive beliefs (e.g. that they will pray for some outcome)?
How can you tell them that their beliefs which seem to have been so useful in cleaning up one aspect of their life, are just wrong thinking?
Ooof. That’d be one of the few instances where I’d be willing to keep my mouth shut. You’re going to pray for X? How nice for you. Nod and smile. How about that local sports team?
I don’t approve of religion in general, but if that magical belief system got someone to stop seriously self-destructive behaviors, I’m generally willing to cut the person some slack. (That of course ends if the person tries converting me, but that’s a different question.)
You can admire and affirm their humanity and the progress they’ve made without enabling their dependence on religion. There’s no need to go picking fights with people, that’s what gives Atheists a bad name with a fair number of people.
You can say things like. “While you and I might disagree on religion Joe, you’re the one that took the actions that turned your life around and I admire that. You’re the one that stuck with it and stayed sober. Good for you.”
Saying things like that points back to what actually happened, fairy tales aside. They took the required actions to alter the course of their life. Acknowledge that and ignore the nonsense. It’s exactly like praising a child.
The central theme to a certain, an arguably most successful, class of self-help programs is the acceptance of a Higher Power. To them the Higher Power, often (but not always) referred to as God, is seen as the only thing that could possibly remove the obsession from the afflicted person. This approaches dogmatic, especially in certain groups like AA.
However, in the literature of these programs- it can be read directly, but also often between the lines, that the acceptance of a power greater than yourself is psychologically advantageous as it can remove the self-centered, control obsessed nature from the afflicted person. It is those traits that are seen as the driving factor towards substance abuse/alcoholism.
So when your friend is getting all high :) and mighty- perhaps it’s not a time to undermine his beliefs (as if such was successful it could destroy his progress)- rather point out that he is not acting consistently with the ideas that enabled him to reach his “new life.” These programs also preach a patience, tolerance, and acceptance. They emphasize an aversion to willful confrontation. But the bottom line is that they certainly emphasize that he does not know everything (he is not the center of the universe) and it is his old demons rearing their heads if he is asserting that he does.
An old AA trick is that if someone is praying for you, you simply ask if it wouldn’t be more correct for him to pray to your higher power. When he asks who, respond that you are fully accepting of the idea that the universal human experience and the precepts of science are greater than one man and that’s what works for you.
How can you tell them that their beliefs which seem to have been so beneficial are just wrong thinking?
Don’t. Just smile and nod.
The world would be a better place if we all adopted a live and let live attitude. If your friend wants/needs religion to help with his addiction, then let him do so without comment.
If he asks for your beliefs, share them honestly. If he tries to convert you, remind him of your choices and ask him to respect them. If he won’t then perhaps he’s not the type of person you want to spend time with in the first place.
Since the question is a pure thought experiment, it doesn’t make much sense to ask, whether the person is informed about the placebo effect.
If someone prays for some outcome, he believes in physical interference, which means god gets measurable. He should be provable to some double blind experiment then.
If someone claims, religion helped him to turn his life around, I would try to help him to debunk his belief; if he wouldn’t want me to do so, I wouldn’t insist to help him.
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